Dinner with designer Julien Dossena

Julien Dossena has been creative director at Paco Rabanne since 2013. We meet at Ristorante da Giacomo, a Milanese classic chosen by Julien who has always wanted to try it. He has just arrived in town for work and our talk is immediately animated and full of discoveries. I learn, for example, that Julien’s father is Italian and that his name, Atto, was the inspiration for his first brand; that one of his ancestors, Alceo Dossena, was one of the best Italian sculptors and forgers of the 19th century; that Julien’s first ambition in life was to become an artist and how fashion is the perfect synthesis of all the art forms that intrigue him.

FF

Have you just arrived in Milan?
JD

Yeah, I got here this afternoon.
The waiter arrives. We order a mix of raw fish and white wine.
FF

I’ve been following your work for some time now, and I wanted to ask you what happened to your brand. I love the name: Atto.
JF

That’s my father’s name, actually. He’s Italian and that’s an old Italian name. I thought it was interesting because at the same time it sounds Japanese, because of the symmetry. I put it on hold because I was just starting out with Paco Rabanne and I didn’t want two competing brands, even though they were so different. If Paco Rabanne hadn’t given me carte blanche, I would have loved to continue Atto as a new brand, because I loved that project and I loved working on it. I love to operate without shows and just make good, strong products.
FF

I always prefer a presentation because you can talk to the designer properly, see the clothes and it also gives a proper idea of what the work is about.
JD

True. It’s more quality time than a show.
FF

Were you working in fashion before Balenciaga or it was your first job?
JD

That was my first job in a studio. Before that, I did the Festival de Hyères as a student and I won the prize in 2006, which gave me the opportunity to make a little capsule collection in my name. After 8 months I was hired as an intern in Balenciaga. I get a few job offers, but Balenciaga was the only brand I wanted to work for, so I refused them all just for a chance to work there. I was already working and making money, but I called my father and said “Can you help me? I’m sure I’m gonna get a job there because I’m gonna work super hard, but I’m gonna need a little help for the next 6 months”. So, I began this internship. Then I was hired and I stayed there for almost five years.
FF

But fashion was your goal from…
JD

Not for a long time, actually. When I was a teenager, I was doing fine arts and I was drawing all the time. Then, for a while I wanted to be a curator, so I began art history, but I soon realized that I missed drawing. At the same time, I was discovering photography and i-D, getting to know this sporty, skate scene… And then I arrived at fashion. I was bored with the arts and so I thought fashion might be interesting, because you have to curate something, to think about branding, you have to draw and you have to work on scenography, photo shows… I told my parents “I might move to Paris to work in fashion” – I think I was coming out at that time – and my parents were like “Okay, what’s next?”, you know?
FF

Super scared!
Laughter
JD

I went to Paris and I began the Duperré school. I hated it because it was always talking about Delacroix and Dior and Chanel, and when I was in Paris I was discovering the Japanese, especially Yamamoto, and I was thinking about Margiela and the Belgians. So, I made some friends and said “Let’s move to Belgium, let’s see what it’s like” and I went to La Cambre and Antwerp to check the two schools, but in Antwerp you had to speak Flemish… So, I said to my friends “Let’s go to Brussels and see what it’s like”, and it was about Olivier Theyskens, who came from that school and was doing shows. There was something in the air that I felt as soon as I saw it, so we stayed there and that’s where I learned how hard it was and how much work you have to put into fashion to make it work.
FF

Please, eat! This is supposed to be more like a dinner with friends than an actual, serious interview.
Laughter
The waiter brings rockfish dishes.

Dossena’s grandfather’s grandfather, Alceo Dossena, was a sculptor, a really good one, and he was famous for making fake things. One of the books about his work is “The sculptor that can do anything”.

FF

Where do you come from, exactly?
JD

It’s a place called Le Pouldu, in Brittany. It’s officially a harbour village and there are only three hundred of us in the winter, but there are a lot of tourists in the summer. There is a strong local identity, like culture, costumes and everything. My grandfather is Italian, he came to Brittany in the Sixties and met my grandmother.
FF

Where is he from?
JD

His family was originally from Cremona, but he was born and raised in Rome. My grandfather’s grandfather, Alceo Dossena, was a sculptor, a really good one, and he was famous for making fake things. There’s a book about him, it is called “The sculptor that can do anything”, because he could do anything from Donatello to Etruscan, and he could do Da Vinci…
FF

But, he didn’t do anything original?
JD

He did, but it wasn’t as modernist.
FF

Tell me about Paco Rabanne. The last show was super interesting because of the new use of the mesh you brought in. What was the concept behind the last season?
JD

I love contemporary dance. I discovered some videos: there’s a woman dancing in an industrial building, feminine, but tragic and intellectual at the same time, and physical. That was always what I wanted at Paco Rabanne. That kind of sensuality where the body is there and existing in the movement, in the speed and even in the sexuality. It was about working on the movement and attitude of the body. The same for the mesh, it was about making a metallic movement, like the Gonzalez Torres installation full of little silvers candies.
FF

How does fashion relates to eroticism?
JD

In a lot of ways. It’s material around the body so it’s very suggestive, which is the core of eroticism.
FF

Have you ever met Paco Rabanne?
JD

Never. I’d love to, but I’m a bit scared. I don’t know how he would react. If he asks to meet me someday, then I would love to and I would want to ask him a lot of questions, but I find it more respectful to wait.
FF

I think that’s wise. It would be so inspiring to meet him, because he was ground-breaking in his time.
JD

It fitted perfectly with what society was facing at that time: social revolution, talking to young generations… But when you discover it more and more, it’s the true expression of a man, of an artist. He especially wanted to work on metal and the metallic women were super interesting at that time, it was modern.
FF

What was super interesting, as you say, is that he was taking inspiration from his era and so what you are doing now should be expressing that.
JD

When I arrived there, the mission was: how to make Paco Rabanne now. To make it for the girls right now, who are working, living and dealing with their lives. I had to adapt it to the lifestyle of the women now.
FF

I read that you’re often called a fashion outsider. How do you feel about that?
JD

I guess it’s because I come from a studio. I don’t believe in the designer: my own brand doesn’t have my name on the label and I never wanted it in that sense because I found it old fashioned. It’s about the relevance of the brand and not who the designer is. I never take too much notice of that. It is not what I expected from the job. My job is making clothes.
Laughter
FF

Please tell us a bit about the SS18 collection.
JD

It was a reflection on movements and bodies in space, conceptual yet sensual and gracious.
FF

Are you doing any advertising campaigns?
JD

We are doing a three-day shoot with Scheltens & Abbenes for Paco Rabanne. It’s the third one we’ve done with them. They’re perfect. They are real artists. Did you see our first campaign?
FF

No! How come I never saw it?
JD

I’d say because we have a really light media plan.
Laughter

My own brand doesn’t have my name on the label and I never wanted it in that sense because I found it old fashioned.

The waiter arrives and asks about dessert. We order some fruit.
FF

Do you speak Breton?
JD

No, I don’t. There are some special schools, where you learn it. It’s a really independent countryside, they want to have their own language. Some of them still think that it can be the kingdom of Brittany, where everybody speaks Breton.
FF

Where do you see yourself in ten years?
JD

Somewhere in a warm climate.
FF

That’s what I call a nice wish.